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Covid-19 Updates & Info

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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#136

Post by mmmm8 »

ponchi101 wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:43 pm Everything seems to be pointing to the vaccine being the sole solution. That article is very useful explaining why.
Hidden in there, also an interesting fact: EVERYBODY in Israel has a health provider, making it easier to gather stats and deliver the vaccine. A big plus for centralized health systems, as an argument to hold when you talk to those that oppose such schemes.
Those who oppose such schemes often oppose any centralized data gathering, and sometimes data :)
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#137

Post by ponchi101 »

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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#138

Post by ti-amie »

“Do not grow old, no matter how long you live. Never cease to stand like curious children before the Great Mystery into which we were born.” Albert Einstein
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#139

Post by patrick »

Local news said that Rebekah Jones was tested positive for Covid-19 today if I heard correctly. She is out on 2500 bond but do not know if any other conditions are attached.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#140

Post by Togtdyalttai »

Whoever is responsible for this, we're already doing bad enough as a state in our vaccine rollout. :roll: Also, maybe it's not the worst thing that I couldn't get my mom an appointment yet.

California pauses Covid-19 shots from one lot of vaccine containing more than 330,000 doses

(CNN)Health officials in California are telling medical providers across the state not to administer doses from one lot of Moderna's coronavirus vaccine while they investigate possible severe allergic reactions last week in a number of people who got shots at a community vaccination clinic.
More than 330,000 doses from the lot were distributed to 287 providers across the state from January 5-12. Tens of thousands of doses may have already been administered, but the number of unused doses is unknown, according to Darrel Ng, a spokesperson for the California Department of Public Health.

CDPH said Sunday that fewer than 10 people at a clinic in San Diego who received Covid-19 shots from the lot required medical attention over the span of 24 hours. The state said it was not aware of anyone at any of the other 286 sites who had similar allergic reactions after receiving vaccine from the lot.

California's health department said it recommended pausing the entire lot, noting that there are not immediate replacement doses in addition to what had already been ordered.

"Out of an extreme abundance of caution and also recognizing the extremely limited supply of vaccine, we are recommending that providers use other available vaccine inventory," Dr. Erica Pan, California's state epidemiologist, said in the statement.
Moderna told CNN: "The company is fully cooperating with (the California Department of Public Health) in investigating these reported adverse events. Consistent with the statement from CDPH, at this point Moderna is unaware of comparable adverse events from other vaccination centers which may have administered vaccines from the same lot."

Dr. Paul Offit, director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia, said historically there is no such thing as a bad vaccine lot.

"The (US Food and Drug Administration) is generally so good at making sure that there is no lot-to-lot variation that you don't have a problem with so-called hot lots," he said.

State health officials didn't provide details on the symptoms associated with the allergic reactions but did provide a link to a US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention website about anaphylaxis -- a severe allergic reaction -- which can occur after getting a Covid-19 vaccine. Symptoms of anaphylaxis can include shortness of breath, low blood pressure, rapid heartbeat, dizziness and fainting. The CDC considers an allergic reaction to a Covid-19 vaccine to be severe if the person needs to be treated with epinephrine or must go to the hospital.
Offit, a top US vaccine expert who is a member of the FDA's vaccine advisory committee, said California's decision to hold back doses of vaccine carries its own risks, especially since allergic reactions can be monitored and treated and, in this case, they occurred at only one location.

"There are going to be people who either aren't getting this vaccine or aren't getting their second doses of vaccine, which then puts them at risk in a situation where we have a virus which is rapidly spreading in the country," Offit said. "There's going to be another probably roughly 100,000 people that die over the next couple of months, and among those people could be those who are not getting this vaccine because of quote-unquote 'an abundance of caution.'"

Thirty thousand doses from the lot were pulled from San Diego County's supply, according to the county. On Monday, Santa Clara County said in a statement that 21,800 doses from the lot had been allocated to the county, and that none of the doses had been administered.

California officials acknowledged the risk of a serious adverse reaction to the vaccine is small, noting that while less data exists for Moderna's vaccine, only approximately 1 in 100,000 people experience anaphylaxis with the similar Pfizer vaccine.
"The thing about anaphylaxis is although it is frightening to watch, it's easily identified, it's quickly identified, and it's easily treated with epinephrine," Offit said. "I don't see how taking this off the market is a conservative thing to do or exercising an abundance of caution. I think all it does is put people at risk unnecessarily." Vaccination sites are supposed to monitor people for side effects 15 minutes after they've been vaccinated. Sites are also required to have the means to treat a person for allergic reaction, if needed.

"None of the other places that used it had a problem. It was just one place. So do a careful examination of what was happening at that place," Offit added.

Officials said an investigation by the CDC, the US Food and Drug Administration, Moderna and the state is ongoing.

"We're not saying throw them away. We're not saying don't ever give them," Ng told CNN Monday, noting the state hopes to have an update this week.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/18/health/c ... index.html
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#141

Post by ponchi101 »

Togtdyalttai wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 4:19 am ...

California pauses Covid-19 shots from one lot of vaccine containing more than 330,000 doses

...
"There are going to be people who either aren't getting this vaccine or aren't getting their second doses of vaccine, which then puts them at risk in a situation where we have a virus which is rapidly spreading in the country," Offit said. "There's going to be another probably roughly 100,000 people that die over the next couple of months, and among those people could be those who are not getting this vaccine because of quote-unquote 'an abundance of caution.'"

...

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/18/health/c ... index.html
Further up this topic (or maybe it was in TAT1.0' thread) this was talked about. If you are going to vaccinate 10 million people, the very next day you will have some of them dead, simply because of the stats. It is a huge number of people, and, currently, they are mostly elderly and people in high risk categories. So of course some of them will develop symptoms and reactions, which are not related to the vaccine.
You have to look at the overall numbers: do you let 10 people die because of some allergic reaction that may or may not be caused by the vaccine, or do you let 100K die because of the virus?
The lack of common sense is abysmal

I know. Personally, I could not care less as I have never suffered from any allergies. But it is a balance of your best chances. Take the vaccine, sit in the lobby if you have a history of allergies, and if you do have a reaction, get treated. Much better than ending up in the ventilator.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#142

Post by shtexas »

Dallas is getting bad national press because the stats from the first few days of the vaccine roll-out at Fair Park (where I took my Mom) show it was the wealthier zip codes (North Dallas) that received the vaccine. The comments online are brutal because the articles make it sound like the vaccines were only available in North Dallas. But, Fair Park is not in North Dallas. The real problem is Dallas was not forthcoming with information on the vaccine. You had to go looking and know where and how to look. When I called pharmacies and the county, they were rude and not very informative. It was the internet and neighborhood communication apps that helped me. Many in South Dallas didn't have those resources, so they didn't know to come. This is like voting. You need to get boots on the ground to get the information out and get people signed up. It's a shame. I thought we were doing a good thing when they set the major hub up.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#143

Post by JazzNU »

ponchi101 wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 2:29 pm
Further up this topic (or maybe it was in TAT1.0' thread) this was talked about. If you are going to vaccinate 10 million people, the very next day you will have some of them dead, simply because of the stats. It is a huge number of people, and, currently, they are mostly elderly and people in high risk categories. So of course some of them will develop symptoms and reactions, which are not related to the vaccine.
You have to look at the overall numbers: do you let 10 people die because of some allergic reaction that may or may not be caused by the vaccine, or do you let 100K die because of the virus?
The lack of common sense is abysmal

I know. Personally, I could not care less as I have never suffered from any allergies. But it is a balance of your best chances. Take the vaccine, sit in the lobby if you have a history of allergies, and if you do have a reaction, get treated. Much better than ending up in the ventilator.

Well I have a lengthy history of allergies almost since birth and an amazing (in a bad way) history of allergic reactions. And I can't wait to get the vaccine.

People are bugging. I read a story the other day and I think it was Dr. Ashish Jha who was talking about the vaccine warnings driving him a little bit crazy, because yes mention them, but don't focus them. That they've been underselling the vaccine and it's going to save your life and that should be the focus. I agree. I'll be taking it the moment I can. I absolutely might have an allergic reaction. Won't be the first or the last time. I'll get treated for the reaction as I always do if it's not something I can manage on my own. But honestly, Dr. Fauci mentioned this very early on in the discussion about the allergic reactions to the vaccine, most people like me who have allergic reactions to stuff, know how to deal with them on our own and he said, go to your appointment prepared to deal with an allergic reaction, be looking for it. Thanks for the warning. I will. Can't wait til my number is called.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#144

Post by ti-amie »

Thanks ponchi!

I'm shocked I tell you. SHOCKED!!!

viewtopic.php?p=2345#p2339
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#145

Post by GlennHarman »

Ponchi is so right about the deaths after the vaccine. If we vaccinate thousands of people over the age of 80 who live in long-term-care facilities, a fair number of them will die soon after the vaccine. Of course, a fair number of them would have died during the same time without the vaccine. When one is doing a clinical trial on any treatment, this is the function of the control group when one is used. There are always "events" that will occur in both groups. You don't want a vaccine given 3 weeks ago to be blamed for a death in an automobile accident, as one sort of an extreme example.

Obviously, it is not good that those people are dying. But the risk of death from an allergic reaction should be very low, given the extensive trials that have been done. But that risk is precisely why people should "sit in the lobby...and if you do have a reaction, get treated." (quoting Ponchi)
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#146

Post by Suliso »

Israel has now reached 38% vaccination rate (first dose only). That means they must have mostly exhausted elderly and risk categories and are ready to start with general population. Of course all this is possible only because of their special deal with Pfizer.

You can see data from other countries here: https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

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Post by Suliso »

Purely statistically there is something else I'm wondering about. Very large percentage of fatalities (30-40%) have been from long term care facilities. Residents of such facilities statistically have only few more years of life left on average. Will we see significantly reduced death rates among elderly a year and two after the pandemic? Simply because a large percentage of most vulnerable will have died already in 2020 and 2021.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#148

Post by ponchi101 »

You know it has been my main gripe about this pandemic: the lack of proper statistical analysis. The virus does not affect everybody in the same way. As you say, a large portion (perhaps even disproportionately large) of the deaths has come from those facilities you are talking about. People with underlying conditions and of a certain age. So yes, what you are saying will likely happen: the "strongest" of the elderly will see a reduction in death rates because the "weaker" ones will succumb to C19 in 2020/21.
I am also waiting for the total number of deaths worldwide in 2020 to be tallied. Generally, it should be about the same as 2019 PLUS 2 million from covid. If there is a large discrepancy, that will be an interesting study.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#149

Post by ponchi101 »

Suliso wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 12:52 pm Israel has now reached 38% vaccination rate (first dose only). That means they must have mostly exhausted elderly and risk categories and are ready to start with general population. Of course all this is possible only because of their special deal with Pfizer.

You can see data from other countries here: https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations
Sorry. I missed that one. What special deal with Pfizer?
Meanwhile, here, the government is waiting to start in February. New roablock? They don't know if they have enough syringes for everybody. So they don't know when to start.
I mean, just START! Get the risk populations vaccinated. It is the typical mentality: trying to make it so perfect that then nothing gets done.
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Re: Covid-19 Updates & Info

#150

Post by Suliso »

ponchi101 wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:49 pm Sorry. I missed that one. What special deal with Pfizer?
Meanwhile, here, the government is waiting to start in February. New roablock? They don't know if they have enough syringes for everybody. So they don't know when to start.
I mean, just START! Get the risk populations vaccinated. It is the typical mentality: trying to make it so perfect that then nothing gets done.
They get a preferential treatment in vaccine delivery in exchange for providing medical data exclusively to Pfizer and also they paid 50% more than others. Everyone in Israel will get this particular vaccine. From Pfizer's point of view they chose Israel as a testing ground (kind of phase IV trials) because of modest population (9 millions) and very centralized medical systems with everyone being insured and all data collected centrally.
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