by ti-amie Laver Cup
Boston, MA, U.S.A.
September 24 - 26 2021
TEAM EUROPE 2021
DANIIL MEDVEDEV
STEFANOS TSITSIPAS
ALEXANDER ZVEREV
ANDREY RUBLEV
MATTEO BERRETTINI
CASPER RUUD
FELICIANO LÓPEZ
(ALTERNATE)
BJÖRN BORG(CAPTAIN)
THOMAS ENQVIST(VICE CAPTAIN)
TEAM WORLD 2021
DENIS SHAPOVALOV
DIEGO SCHWARTZMAN
FELIX AUGER-ALIASSIME
REILLY OPELKA
JOHN ISNER
NICK KYRGIOS
JACK SOCK
(ALTERNATE)
JOHN MCENROE (CAPTAIN)
PATRICK MCENROE (VICE CAPTAIN)
by ti-amie HOW LAVER CUP WORKS
The Laver Cup pits six top European players against six of their counterparts from the rest of the World.
LAVER CUP FORMAT
The event is played over three days. On Friday and Saturday, there is a day and night session followed by a final single day session on Sunday.
Each day four matches are played – three singles and a doubles.
Both singles and doubles are best of three sets with ad scoring. In the event of split sets, the third set is a 10-point match tiebreaker.
Each player competes in at least one singles match during the first two days.
No player can play singles more than twice during the three days.
At least four of the six players must play doubles. No doubles combination is played more than once, unless for the Decider on Day 3, if points are 12:12.
The winning team must reach 13 points.
In the event of a tie after all 12 matches are played, a final overtime doubles match – a Decider – is played as a regular set with ad scoring and a tiebreak.
Friday’s lineup is announced on Thursday afternoon.
Saturday’s lineup is announced an hour after play ends on Friday night.
Sunday’s lineup is announced an hour after play ends on Saturday night.
Match-ups are determined through the exchange of lineup cards by the captains.
LAVER CUP SCORING
Points scoring
Each match win is worth one point on Friday, two points on Saturday, and three points on Sunday.
How to win the Laver Cup
The first team to reach 13 points out of a total 24 points available wins the Laver Cup. If the points are tied at 12:12 at the end of all matches, a fifth match (Decider) on Sunday is played to determine the winner.
COURT SURFACE
The event is always played on one competition hard court in a retractable roof stadium or indoor arena.
TEAM CAPTAINS
Each team is captained by a legend of the sport. Björn Borg is the captain of Team Europe and John McEnroe is the captain of Team World.
Captain’s Role
The captains are responsible for selecting the three captain’s picks as well as the players for singles and doubles matches.
by JTContinental Not sure if this has been mentioned elsewhere, but it appears the Laver Cup Twitter account is blocking anyone who comments in their mentions about the Zverev situation.
by
ti-amie JTContinental wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:44 pm
Not sure if this has been mentioned elsewhere, but it appears the Laver Cup Twitter account is blocking anyone who comments in their mentions about the Zverev situation.
I don't know if it was mentioned here either but Tennis Twitter has been reporting on it.
by ti-amie Honestly I didn't know what to do with this event. In my mind it's an exhibition.
by
JTContinental ti-amie wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:49 pm
JTContinental wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:44 pm
Not sure if this has been mentioned elsewhere, but it appears the Laver Cup Twitter account is blocking anyone who comments in their mentions about the Zverev situation.
I don't know if it was mentioned here either but Tennis Twitter has been reporting on it.
The funny part is everyone can still see the comments if they are blocked (except for the original poster of the comment), so doesn't seem to be doing any good, damage-controlwise
by
ti-amie JTContinental wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:51 pm
ti-amie wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:49 pm
JTContinental wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:44 pm
Not sure if this has been mentioned elsewhere, but it appears the Laver Cup Twitter account is blocking anyone who comments in their mentions about the Zverev situation.
I don't know if it was mentioned here either but Tennis Twitter has been reporting on it.
The funny part is everyone can still see the comments if they are blocked (except for the original poster of the comment), so doesn't seem to be doing any good, damage-controlwise
by meganfernandez Not excited about Laver Cup at all without Roger and Rafa.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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mick1303 ti-amie wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:52 pm
Honestly I didn't know what to do with this event. In my mind it's an exhibition.
Since ATP does count these matches towards head-to-heads, I'm also including them in my database (along with Davis Cup). They will not bring points and will not influence points-related categories of weighted ranking. But they affect non-points related categories (like win percentages, etc.)
by
the Moz Team Europe for the Lamer Cup please
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ponchi101 meganfernandez wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:36 am
Not excited about Laver Cup at all without Roger and Rafa.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
the Moz wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:42 am
Team Europe for the Lamer Cup please
I will watch it because there is no other tennis on TV for me. But this will be the very first test for this. Sans R&R, and not even Novak, TV ratings and attendance will determine how viable this product is.
It might be good for the Davis Cup. For all its faults, it was still the one event where players could feel a but of national pride (I am talking about the old format). Here, I really wonder how does Schwartzman, Isner or Kyrgios feel about representing "the rest of the world".
by
meganfernandez ponchi101 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:12 pm
meganfernandez wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:36 am
Not excited about Laver Cup at all without Roger and Rafa.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
the Moz wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:42 am
Team Europe for the Lamer Cup please
I will watch it because there is no other tennis on TV for me. But this will be the very first test for this. Sans R&R, and not even Novak, TV ratings and attendance will determine how viable this product is.
It might be good for the Davis Cup. For all its faults, it was still the one event where players could feel a but of national pride (I am talking about the old format). Here, I really wonder how does Schwartzman, Isner or Kyrgios feel about representing "the rest of the world".
For me, this is all about the social media content. The fun moments. Just want to see Tsitsipas spray Borg right in the eye with champagne again.
by skatingfan Isner & Opelka are too tall for the one size fits none style of jacket - maybe that why they're wearing grey & everyone else is in black?
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JazzNU skatingfan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:46 pm
Isner & Opelka are too tall for the one size fits none style of jacket - maybe that why they're wearing grey & everyone else is in black?
And apparently neither could afford a tailor.
by JazzNU I don't want to encourage Nick on this end, but Casper looks wildly out of place in this venue, even more so than Reilly. Gives a massive who's that vibe in that photo. Given he's on Team Europe, kind of shocked he got the invite, I have to think the official ATP status is part of the reason for it and it's likely a mistake. I'd have gone with one of the more obvious choices for more crowd appeal especially with Roger missing.
Thomas looks fabulous. Whatever the hell is in the water in Sweden is divine and I'm shocked more aren't trying to figure out what anti-aging properties must exist in it.
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mick1303 JazzNU wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:21 am
I don't want to encourage Nick on this end, but Casper looks wildly out of place in this venue, even more so than Reilly. Gives a massive who's that vibe in that photo. Given he's on Team Europe, kind of shocked he got the invite, I have to think the official ATP status is part of the reason for it and it's likely a mistake. I'd have gone with one of the more obvious choices for more crowd appeal especially with Roger missing.
Thomas looks fabulous. Whatever the hell is in the water in Sweden is divine and I'm shocked more aren't trying to figure out what anti-aging properties must exist in it.
Team Europe was definitely combined based on merit. If you look at win-loss records for the season, they all are up there, including Ruud. No mascots, like Kyrgios (7-7 record in 2021). Who would you put instead of Ruud anyway? Alcaraz? Sinner? Hurkacz? If this is show rather than competition, they should've invited Fognini ))
by
ti-amie 
by ti-amie Someone here said it. They're hitting social media hard.
by
JazzNU mick1303 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:23 am
JazzNU wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:21 am
I don't want to encourage Nick on this end, but Casper looks wildly out of place in this venue, even more so than Reilly. Gives a massive who's that vibe in that photo. Given he's on Team Europe, kind of shocked he got the invite, I have to think the official ATP status is part of the reason for it and it's likely a mistake. I'd have gone with one of the more obvious choices for more crowd appeal especially with Roger missing.
Thomas looks fabulous. Whatever the hell is in the water in Sweden is divine and I'm shocked more aren't trying to figure out what anti-aging properties must exist in it.
Team Europe was definitely combined based on merit. If you look at win-loss records for the season, they all are up there, including Ruud. No mascots, like Kyrgios (7-7 record in 2021). Who would you put instead of Ruud anyway? Alcaraz? Sinner? Hurkacz? If this is show rather than competition, they should've invited Fognini ))
Easily would've gone with Monfils first, then Dimitrov or Fognini. If forced to pick a young guy, I'd go Sinner. As far as I can tell, Grigor still commands more fan attention than Fabio. And I don't think really anyone who gets the invite turns it down unless your name is Nadal or Djokovic. Hard to turn down what is the biggest non-grand slam check of the year except for a 1000 final. Shapo surely tripped over himself as he rushed to accept that invitation.
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dmforever ti-amie wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:17 pm
Whoever took the pic of Team Europe should never ever work again as they have taken the only unflattering picture of Sig Berrettini in existence.
Oh, and do the players have a monetary incentive for winning matches, or are they paid the same no matter how they do? I don't really know much about LC.
Kevin
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JazzNU dmforever wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:23 am
Oh, and do the players have a monetary incentive for winning matches, or are they paid the same no matter how they do? I don't really know much about LC.
Kevin
Paid no matter what, the goal is to win the cup. $250k each for the winners, $125k each for the losers. And appearance fees on top of that and there a wide range of what is paid out in fees. As I've mentioned before when you guys complained about Kyrgios, this was his goal, because this is his big payday. He's making a king's ransom for the weekend, he's the one who does the promotion with Federer for the World team.
by JazzNU ^^^Not 100% certain but if I had to guess, the Team Europe video got pulled because the comments were starting to get populated with pro and con comments about Sascha despite him not really being in that video. I don't know why else it would get pulled, it appeared to be that without Sacha, the World video was the one that was the bigger hit with fans anyway, but the Europe one had people liking Stef's intro to Daniil I believe.
by Fastbackss I couldn't even make it through the introductions without wanting to switch back to Ryder Cup.
(I also feel like they turned up the noise for Zverev)
by JazzNU I didn't think they did anything during Zverev's introduction, which got a decent amount of applause and I was trying to listen for boos (didn't hear any). Must really chap Stef that he barely got better applause.
I noticed this was taking place at the same time as the Ryder Cup. I don't watch golf so not competition for me. That being said, clearly this first match is a chance for me to run a few errands.
by JazzNU Legitimately surprised that there wasn't some quick word from Roger to the crowd to start the proceedings. Rewound because I thought maybe I had missed it, but no, nothing.
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JazzNU JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 5:37 pm
Legitimately surprised that there wasn't some quick word from Roger to the crowd to start the proceedings. Rewound because I thought maybe I had missed it, but no, nothing.
Clearly this should've happened. Instead spotted in the crowd, put on the big screen, applause started, he graciously accepted, applause continued with no sign of stopping, he then stood up and waved to the entire crowd. All in the middle of the first set, just awkwardly between two games. Roger and Tony don't know the crowd loves and misses him? Come now.
by ponchi101 Maybe they are testing if this is viable without any of the big three being "there". I know this has very little history yet but, this is the first time that the winningest players on court are the coaches. Total slams between all players = 1.
We are still not certain we will see The Laver Cup in 2030.
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MJ2004 JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:06 pm
Come now.
lol
I banked on my guess that neither R would play there
and it would be a crap line-up and didn't buy tickets for this event, held 5 minutes from my husband's office.
I'm a homebody so hopefully doesn't reflect on long term viability without them.
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JazzNU ponchi101 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:30 pm
Maybe they are testing if this is viable without any of the big three being "there". I know this has very little history yet but, this is the first time that the winningest players on court are the coaches. Total slams between all players = 1.
We are still not certain we will see The Laver Cup in 2030.
He'll be at the Laver Cup not playing every year after he is retired. Him greeting the crowd at the start wouldn't affect anything and could be how it is done in the future.
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JazzNU MJ2004 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 7:24 pm
I banked on my guess that neither R would play there and didn't buy tickets for this event, held
5 minutes from my husband's office.
I'm a homebody so hopefully doesn't reflect on long term viability without them.
Jealous. That's a great area to work in. Some of my favorite lunch places ever in that part of town.
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MJ2004 JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 7:40 pm
Jealous. That's a great area to work in. Some of my favorite lunch places ever in that part of town.
Yes. The greatest thing is that he can take the commuter rail in and walk to his office without having to take the T. I used to switch from rail to T and it was hell.
by JazzNU We probably should've taken a poll before this began on how we thought this would go. I've previously said (Tournament thread I believe) that I thought Europe would win and it wouldn't be as competitive as 2019.
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ponchi101 JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 8:21 pm
We probably should've taken a poll before this began on how we thought this would go. I've previously said (Tournament thread I believe) that I thought Europe would win and it wouldn't be as competitive as 2019.
Done.
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Suliso JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 8:21 pm
We probably should've taken a poll before this began on how we thought this would go. I've previously said (Tournament thread I believe) that I thought Europe would win and it wouldn't be as competitive as 2019.
If everyone takes it very seriously Europe is a far stronger team even without the big three. Six top 10 players vs none!!! FAA probably the strongest opposing player.
by Fastbackss These courts seem slow...with spin having a lot of impact.
by ponchi101 I was saying that earlier today (to my GF). Opelka's ace count was rather low, for him.
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martini4me They've said the paint on the court is very gritty, so it favours the faster players/defenders/clay-courters (e.g. Ruud, FAA) more than the heavy serve-and-forehand (Opelka, Berrettini) guys.
I'm about 20 minutes behind live, but there's been some very high quality in this FAA-Berrettini match. I think it was the third game of the second set where Felix had at least three exceptional points, and Berrettini one also. This may be an exhibition, but it's FAR from hit-and-giggle tennis.
JazzNU wrote: ↑Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:02 am
I believe Nick is sending this photo in with his application to be the next James Bond.
by Suliso If team World can beat neither Berrettini nor Ruud, on paper the weakest two Europeans, then I don't see them having much chance this year.
by ponchi101 That was not a bad match at all. Actually, pretty good.
Commentator down here: "Berrettini's best BH passing shot came in the last point of the match". I agree.
I find it interesting that both Mac and Borg are showing that their personalities during their playing days were not facades. Mac is pacing like the man whose pregnant wife has been in the delivery room for 4 hours. Borg is sitting down, waiting for his flute of champagne.
by martini4me The Matteo-Felix match was the longest in Laver Cup history. Granted, that's a very short history. But since we're talking about matches that are two sets and a first-to-10 tiebreaker, 2:52 gives a good indication of how competitive it was.
Berrettini said in the on-court interview after the match, that when he agreed to also play doubles later tonight, he was not expecting the singles match to be so long!
by JazzNU The 2019 matches were very competitive as well, with many matches going into a super tiebreak. It's definitely not a garden variety exhibition, it's closer to an ATP Cup or Davis Cup where the effort is the same as it would be in a tour match. It's just the limited nature of who can play makes it feel like an exhibition and makes it seem like it shouldn't appear on the ATP's schedule.
by ponchi101 BTW. All of the players using HEAD racquets are using a new one with black/red cosmetics. They look like all are the same, a variation of the RADICAL line. But Zverev and Rublev use GRAVITY's.
Any idea if this is just a one time thing for this cup?
by Deuce I think there should be an option in the poll for 'It's not relevant'. That would certainly be my pick.
It would not surprise me in the least if at least some of the matches are 'fixed' - that is, the winner is determined before the match begins - to create more interest or 'drama'.
The louder the P.A. announcer at the venue yells, and the more fancy light shows there are, the more desperate they are to aggressively sell a weak product in most cases.
The main thing I like about the Laver Cup is the grey court, and how the red and blue shirts, and the yellow/green ball, contrast with it.
It's also sometimes interesting to see how the players relate to one another, trying to differentiate between the phony niceness and the genuine.
by JazzNU Seems like subbing in Jack Sock for Shapo would've made that a more certain point for Team World, but luckily they got it anyway and it appears some of that is because John asked him to lead the team conference before the match tiebreak and talk best strategy there. Jack has been a strength for Team World in every year it's been held, which is impressive given the condition he's shown at times in recent years.
by
ti-amie 
by mick1303 I've watched highlights of all matches on Youtube. And actually liked a quality of tennis very much. In singles anyway. Maybe team Europe sacrificed doubles match, not substituting Berrettini after his long match. And Zverev is a horrible doubles player. But given the format of 1-2-3 points, when the importance of each day increases - what happened on Day 1 does not affect the result all that much.
by ti-amie
I read that Carillo did commentary yesterday though?
by ponchi101 I thought that, with the total screwup for the transmission yesterday here in S. America, it was her in the background. Her voice is pretty distinctive.
Regardless of my opinion in the issue, kudos to Carillo. She stands where her opinions are. A brave position of integrity.
by ti-amie Some are saying it was Renae Stubbs who worked with Courier yesterday?
by dmforever Hmm, I had lost a lot of respect for MC. She's gotten a little back in my book.
OK, here's a hypothesis. The level of play at the LC is pretty high because it's not a "real" tournament, it isn't single elimination, and thus the players feel like there is less to lose, which allows them to play with less pressure. What say y'all?
Kevin
by JazzNU Not that brave IMO. More performative.
And I'd believe Ben's constant reporting was more for the cause if he'd spent even a single Tweet in recent months on Basilashvili, but he hasn't, it's all Zverev, followed by a link to the most recent article he's written.
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ponchi101 dmforever wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 6:40 pm
Hmm, I had lost a lot of respect for MC. She's gotten a little back in my book.
OK, here's a hypothesis. The level of play at the LC is pretty high because it's not a "real" tournament, it isn't single elimination, and thus the players feel like there is less to lose, which allows them to play with less pressure. What say y'all?
Kevin
Uhm, good observation. So maybe indeed they are hitting out freely and are like us, playing at a higher quality when there is no pressure.
I mean, ROTW knows they are getting their $125K, Europe already has their $250K in the bank. Let's watch them hit some fun shots.
I would say you nailed it.
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JazzNU dmforever wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 6:40 pm
OK, here's a hypothesis. The level of play at the LC is pretty high because it's not a "real" tournament, it isn't single elimination, and thus the players feel like there is less to lose, which allows them to play with less pressure. What say y'all?
Kevin
I don't think so personally. But I get why others generally think of it this way.
I think there's a decent enough difference between $125k and $250k to motivate good play (and I would've thought Shapo agreed, but he looked like a liability in that doubles match).
But more than that, I think this is a fantastic tournament to elevate your brand. The upgrade your brand can get when showcased at this event is immense, because there's so little to distract from it. There aren't multiple matches going on at once, it's like the semis or the finals of a grand slam with worldwide TV contracts to rival it. Every player that is in it, win or lose, can greatly benefit their off the court careers here and that's worth playing your heart out for. And in terms of future play on the tour, you can show a little something about yourself, get players in the locker room to take your more seriously. Ruud, for instance, was not favored to win that match against Opelka, I believe he was a 65/35 underdog, but he's looking a lot less like just a clay court player after yesterday's match.
by ponchi101 Agreed. But as you say, you have a good chance of improving your brand, but not too much to diminish it. It is sort of WIN-WIN, regardless of the results.
Shapo last night simply showed what a lot of people already say. His net game is one thing he can improve, by a lot. Why Mac put him there.... let me know if you have an idea. I don't.
by
dmforever I would be very very hard pressed to come up with a match I have less of a rooting interest in than Zverev-Isner. Is there a way they can both loose? Maybe get injured on the same point and both have to retire? I'm sure there are more creative ways that could happen. One of them pulls a Nole and the other punches him and gets arrested?
But seriously, yuck.
Kevin
by JazzNU No clue, Jack Sock was sitting right there.
But I think Shapo hurt his brand with his showing yesterday. Done next to nothing since Wimbledon, he can use this weekend to show that wasn't a fluke (much like Zverev did in 2019 I believe, when he was able to change the narrative with his showing), and he didn't show anything but disappointment really. Hopefully he'll look good in his singles match, which I would assume he's scheduled to play.
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skatingfan JazzNU wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:05 pm
No clue, Jack Sock was sitting right there.
But I think Shapo hurt his brand with his showing yesterday. Done next to nothing since Wimbledon, he can use this weekend to show that wasn't a fluke (much like Zverev did in 2019 I believe, when he was able to change the narrative with his showing), and he didn't show anything but disappointment really. Hopefully he'll look good in his singles match, which I would assume he's scheduled to play.
This surface doesn't suit Shapovalov very well, so I doubt he'll play well this weekend. His timing during the doubles match looked awful.
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JazzNU skatingfan wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:11 pm
This surface doesn't suit Shapovalov very well, so I doubt he'll play well this weekend. His timing during the doubles match looked awful.
I saw comments about the surface earlier in the thread. What about this surface is so bad for Shapo that Matteo can see his way to overcoming it but he can't?
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skatingfan JazzNU wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:17 pm
I saw comments about the surface earlier in the thread. What about this surface is so bad for Shapo that Matteo can see his way to overcoming it but he can't?
It's too slow, and it seems a bit sticky. Berretini on the forehand can hit through the court a bit better than Shapovalov.
by Suliso If it goes well in the future I can see this becoming a semi official tournament. First four or five players qualify by ranking and the remaining 1-2 are wild cards selected by the captain. Similar to Ryder cup which is widely popular in golf.
by
Deuce ti-amie wrote: ↑Sat Sep 25, 2021 5:55 pm
I read that Carillo did commentary yesterday though?
Carillo has long been one of my favourite TV announcers. She's never been afraid to say what she thinks and feels, and I appreciate her intelligent humour.
As for the matches... yes, I suppose the quality of play is good. But has anyone noticed that about 80% of the sets are very close? I believe that it is scripted this way - which is quite typical of exhibitions.
by JazzNU Embarrassing showing from Shapovalov and I think it's a cop out to blame the court speed. Same claim about preference for a fast hard court can again be made for Daniil. Denis had to work harder on his serve in that first set, but it wasn't embarrassing like the second set was.
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skatingfan JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:31 am
Embarrassing showing from Shapovalov and I think it's a cop out to blame the court speed. Same claim about preference for a fast hard court can again be made for Daniil. Denis had to work harder on his serve in that first set, but it wasn't embarrassing like the second set was.
I would agree that Denis played poorly, and made poor shot selections (jumping backhand that he hit right to Medvedev leaving the whole ad court open for example), it's just that the court doesn't suit him as well so it's another factor against him in the match-up.
by skatingfan These guys are so bad at net.
by
JazzNU skatingfan wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:00 am
JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:31 am
Embarrassing showing from Shapovalov and I think it's a cop out to blame the court speed. Same claim about preference for a fast hard court can again be made for Daniil. Denis had to work harder on his serve in that first set, but it wasn't embarrassing like the second set was.
I would agree that Denis played poorly, and made poor shot selections (jumping backhand that he hit right to Medvedev leaving the whole ad court open for example), it's just that the court doesn't suit him as well so it's another factor against him in the match-up.
The court doesn't suit many of these players' games I'd say. But my point is, everyone else seems to be figuring it out so I think Denis should be able to as well. And clay not being his preferred surface hasn't kept him from making the semis of Masters tournaments. I'm not willing to blame the court here especially when he didn't look remotely good on fast hard courts this summer, when one would assume, he shouldn't be struggling at all.
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JazzNU skatingfan wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:55 am
These guys are so bad at net.
Maybe height and wing span is a factor in that? Not sure. Rublev is the shortest, but I don't have the highest opinion of his double skills, he needs to be thanking Nastia for the rest of his life for that Olympic medal.
by Fastbackss Not that the world was going to come back, but winning this match tonight (which they could have especially after winning the first set) was a requirement.
This supertiebreak has been atrocious.
by
dmforever skatingfan wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:55 am
These guys are so bad at net.
I was thinking exactly the same thing. Great groundies by 3/4 of the court but at the net...yikes.
Kevin
by mick1303 I suspect next time they will have to come up with some creative ways to break down the teams. For example, remember that Russia is also located in Asia and make Russian players compete for "The rest of the World". I'm not very familiar with Ryder Cup. Have they ever been doing something like this to make teams even?
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Suliso mick1303 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 7:43 am
I suspect next time they will have to come up with some creative ways to break down the teams. For example, remember that Russia is also located in Asia and make Russian players compete for "The rest of the World". I'm not very familiar with Ryder Cup.
Have they ever been doing something like this to make teams even?
Absolutely not and they shouldn't here either. In Ryder cup too sometimes one team is dominant and so be it. They should just wait for those non European superstars to appear on the horizon. It will happen sooner or later.
by Suliso Talking about such prospects there don't seem to be so many, but perhaps one can single out Shang Juncheng (CHN) who's the current junior #1, only 16 years old and was a runner up at USO few weeks ago. Lives and trains in Bradento, FL. Perhaps a Chinese version of Nishikori and maybe less injury prone?
by
ti-amie 
by ponchi101 The difference between Ryder and Laver cups is that Ryder is established, and both teams have won in its history. The reality is that ROTW has never won, and the upcoming crop of players are also all from Europe (Alcaraz, Sinner, Rune, etc).
Claiming Russia as being in Asia would work geographically. But there is no way the Russians will accept that, I believe.
by
mick1303 ponchi101 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 4:23 pm
The difference between Ryder and Laver cups is that Ryder is established, and both teams have won in its history. The reality is that ROTW has never won, and the upcoming crop of players are also all from Europe (Alcaraz, Sinner, Rune, etc).
Claiming Russia as being in Asia would work geographically. But there is no way the Russians will accept that, I believe.
Why do you think that Russians will be against it? Being Russian myself (at least culturally) I always admit the duality of Russian mentality.
by JazzNU The upcoming crop is not all from Europe.
And no idea why you guys are talking about Ryder Cup as if it has a history of being seriously competitive. That's recent history, traditionally, the US flat out dominated the competition to the point that US vs. UK became US vs. Europe. Laver Cup can make similar changes if that becomes necessary.
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JazzNU ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:19 pm
I see nothing here personally. I was expecting Zverev's hand to be left hanging or something based on that description.
by ti-amie I thought the look, the up and down one and then turning away was enough.
by mick1303 I'm glad that sporting/competitive side of the event prevailed and team Europe did not donate matches.
by
Suliso JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:23 pm
The upcoming crop is not all from Europe.
Whom do you see as particularly promising from the rest of the World?
by
JazzNU ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:39 pm
I thought the look, the up and down one and then turning away was enough.
Really seemed like no big deal to me and given they were very warm at the net with each other yesterday, I have a hard time believing this barely there happening is anything.
by
JazzNU Suliso wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 7:36 pm
Whom do you see as particularly promising from the rest of the World?
There are great juniors coming out of the US. The top junior right now is Chinese. There is a recent junior GS winner from Argentina that is starting to climb the rankings. Players that are already rising in the ATP include Sebastian, Frances, Cristian, Lloyd, Jensen and Brandon. SoonWoo Koon just won his first title today. I'm guessing there are several more.
by Suliso Yes, I know most of them. However, are the future Slam winners? I mean juniors aside about which too early to tell. I just don't see it...
by
JazzNU Suliso wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:00 pm
Yes, I know most of them. However, are the future Slam winners? I mean juniors aside about which too early to tell. I just don't see it...
Future Slam winners? When did I say that? Is that how you view Casper?
by
Suliso JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:24 pm
Suliso wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:00 pm
Yes, I know most of them. However, are the future Slam winners? I mean juniors aside about which too early to tell. I just don't see it...
Future Slam winners? When did I say that? Is that how you view Casper?
No, not Casper. But don't you think you need some Slam winner caliber people to win Laver cup?
by
JazzNU Suliso wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:25 pm
No, not Casper. But don't you think you need some Slam winner caliber people to win Laver cup?
Not sure exactly what you consider Slam winner caliber, but I'd say the group I listed includes a couple of those. A reminder that potentially you but certainly others on here were basically laughing at the idea of it when I was putting Matteo in that conversation several months ago. Now, not so much. The group I listed are young, some just starting in the ATP, give them a couple of years and yes, I think they'll make the Laver Cup more competitive.
by
ponchi101 ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:14 pm
Don't know what mister Elsasser is saying. Opelka and Isner are the big servers. The rest of ROTW team do not rely on just one stroke. Shapo and FAA are not huge servers, Diego certainly isn't, Nick has a huge serve but there is more to his game.
by
dmforever JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:38 pm
ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:19 pm
I see nothing here personally. I was expecting Zverev's hand to be left hanging or something based on that description.
Since everyone here knows I'm the biggest Isner fan around, I think I just need to say that he won't shake Zverev's hand, but he'll sure as heck avidly and publicly support a president whom multiple women with stories at least as credible as Zverev's ex's said sexually assaulted them and who bragged about grabbing women by the you know what on live air. Hypocrite much, John?
Kevin
by
Deuce JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:54 pm
Suliso wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 7:36 pm
Whom do you see as particularly promising from the rest of the World?
There are great juniors coming out of the US. The top junior right now is Chinese. There is a recent junior GS winner from Argentina that is starting to climb the rankings. Players that are already rising in the ATP include Sebastian, Frances, Cristian, Lloyd, Jensen and Brandon. SoonWoo Koon just won his first title today. I'm guessing there are several more.
^ I would not include Tiafoe in this group. He's been at this level longer than the others, and has been stagnant for a while now. Talented, to be sure - and a fine career, certainly - but improving significantly now or in the future - doubtful.
As for Isner not shaking Zverev's hand... no-one here knows why he didn't shake his hand. It's pure speculation to say that it's because of the sexual assault allegation. That's a 'good story', but is it accurate? Maybe it is, maybe it's not. Maybe it's because Zverev allegedly said that team world would not win another point after a particular match. Or maybe there was nothing to it at all. He did seem to acknowledge him with a tip of his head.
by
JazzNU dmforever wrote: ↑Mon Sep 27, 2021 4:22 am
Since everyone here knows I'm the biggest Isner fan around, I think I just need to say that he won't shake Zverev's hand, but he'll sure as heck avidly and publicly support a president whom multiple women with stories at least as credible as Zverev's ex's said sexually assaulted them and who bragged about grabbing women by the you know what on live air. Hypocrite much, John?
Kevin
Yes, I said this in the other thread. He also had a warm greeting with him at the net following their match. Someone was trying to ask Stephanie when this was taken because someone else thought it was a photo after said match and that's why he wasn't shaking his hand, it would've been a second hand shake and unnecessary. Sascha doesn't have a jacket on, something I hadn't noticed initially, so that's another possibility. Of course Stephanie didn't answer that person, she's trying to get something/anything trending.
by
ti-amie At the Laver Cup, Europe Might Be Too Good
After Europe’s fourth straight win, an organizer promised Team World would win “at some point.” He didn’t say when.
Team Europe has claimed the Laver Cup in each year of the competition. This time, the score was 14-1.Credit...Clive Brunskill/Getty Images For Laver Cup
By Christopher Clarey
Sept. 27, 2021, 7:50 a.m. ET
BOSTON — After three down-to-the-wire editions, the Laver Cup finally came up short of drama.
It happens, and considering European players’ long-running dominance of men’s tennis, it is frankly more surprising that the first three Laver Cups were suspense magnets than that this year’s edition was a disappointing blowout.
Even without the stars who make up the Big Three in men’s tennis — Roger Federer, Rafael Nadal and Novak Djokovic — Team Europe had nothing but top 10 players in its six-man squad in Boston. Its opponent, Team World, did not have any, and it showed in the final score, 14-1, which was by far the most lopsided in the event’s brief history.
Despite all the careful planning and big investment in this team competition, the bottom line is that Team Europe and Bjorn Borg, its captain, have won every Laver Cup. They have an excellent chance of remaining undefeated in London next year and beyond considering the youth and talent of rising stars like the 2021 U.S. Open champion Daniil Medvedev, his Russian countryman Andrey Rublev, Stefanos Tsitsipas of Greece and Alexander Zverev of Germany.
That competitive imbalance is potentially a big problem for the Laver Cup, the international team event created by Federer and his management company Team8 in 2017.
“I think a Team World win would be good for everyone,” said John McEnroe, Team World’s captain. “I think the event needs it. I was wondering why Russia was part of Europe. I don’t think it is, but that’s just me.”
One cannot blame McEnroe for thinking creatively, even desperately, at this stage. Unfortunately for McEnroe, much of Russia is indeed in continental Europe, and the country traditionally takes part in European sporting competitions. Even if eastern Russia is in Asia, Medvedev and the Russians will remain part of Team Europe, according to Tony Godsick, the Laver Cup’s chief executive.
“We won’t make the change,” Godsick said Sunday night. “We’re not going to adjust this thing. It will be cyclical. I promise you, the world team will win at some point.”
The Laver Cup, with its three-day format and blue and red color scheme for team uniforms, was modeled after golf’s venerable and successful Ryder Cup, and certainly took the modeling too far this time by being played in the same country on the same weekend.
That was not to the upstart tennis competition’s benefit, even though the crowds and the atmosphere were terrific in Boston. A search of “Cup” on Google news on Sunday night produced a top-10 that was all Ryder Cup results from Whistling Straits.
Godsick said the scheduling overlap was not intentional. Both events were postponed in 2020, and he said that the Laver Cup has a designated week on the tennis schedule that could not be changed.
The Ryder Cup, which was first contested in 1927 in Worcester, Mass., had to evolve to become a major event and commercial juggernaut. Originally a competition between the United States and Britain, it only became a runaway success after players from other European nations joined the British team in 1979.
But if the Russians are remaining part of Team Europe in the Laver Cup, not much other tinkering can be done in the geography department. Team World already is open to every non-European nation and had players this year from Argentina (Diego Schwartzman), Australia (Nick Kyrgios), Canada (Denis Shapovalov and Felix Auger-Aliassime) and the United States (Reilly Opelka and John Isner).
For now, McEnroe is 0-4 as its captain, and his Laver Cup rivalry with his old friend Borg has not been nearly as balanced as their rivalry when they were playing classic Grand Slam finals in the 1980s.
“I normally do like you,” the gray-haired McEnroe said to the gray-haired Borg on Sunday at the awards ceremony in the TD Garden. “I hate your guts right now.”
McEnroe was only half kidding. Arms folded in his courtside chair, he looked like a man experiencing indigestion for much of this long weekend.
Technically, the Laver Cup is an exhibition. It offers no ranking points even though it is a sanctioned ATP Tour event.
But the captains and the players have never treated it as an exhibition, and Team World’s failure to compete in Boston was certainly not linked to a failure to care. Their expressions were often anguished and their body language often tense as they lost critical point after critical point, usually in the match tiebreakers that substitute for third sets.
“It’s not an exhibition,” Opelka said. “If this was an exhibition, it would not have been 14-1. I can guarantee you that.”
Opelka, a towering and bearded player at 6-foot-11 who lost both his matches in his Laver Cup debut, confessed that he had been skeptical until he experienced the event himself this year.
“It looked too good to be true,” he said of the close finishes in 2017, 2018 and 2019. “And then I got here, and the way Johnny Mac started speaking about it changed everything. He’s a true legend. That was priceless being able to spend time with him.”
The Laver Cup’s capacity to bring together tennis’s past and present stars for meaningful exchanges is one of its strengths. So is its format, in which victories are worth one point on the first day, two points on the second and three points on the third. That was intended to prevent a meaningless final day. But while four matches were scheduled on Sunday, Europe clinched victory after only one, with Zverev and Rublev defeating Opelka and Shapovalov, 6-2, 6-7 (4), 10-3. It was yet another close match that went Europe’s way. It was also a potentially edgy one.
After Zverev lost in doubles on Friday night with Matteo Berrettini, McEnroe said that Zverev told him that would be the last match Team World was going to win. McEnroe later acknowledged that Zverev was teasing, but McEnroe said he was eager for “bulletin-board material.”
After McEnroe informed his team of the comment on Friday, the response was predictably bellicose and Opelka responded with: “He also said he’s innocent.” That was an apparent reference to published allegations of domestic violence from Zverev’s former girlfriend, Olya Sharypova.
Sharypova has not filed criminal charges against Zverev over the incidents, which she told the publication Slate occurred in 2019. Zverev has repeatedly denied abusing Sharypova and has continued to play on the ATP Tour, winning the Olympic gold medal in singles in Tokyo and reaching the semifinals of the U.S. Open earlier this month before competing in the Laver Cup.
On Sunday night, Laver Cup organizers announced before Team World’s final news conference that the team would field only “tennis-related questions.” In a separate interview, Opelka later declined to speak about Zverev.
The ATP Tour announced earlier this year that it would review its approach to handling players who are accused of domestic abuse or sexual misconduct. It currently has no formal policy.
Zverev turned out to be correct, though, that the Friday’s doubles win would be Team World’s last victory in Boston. His victory on Sunday with the hard-hitting Rublev marked the third straight time that Zverev has won the decisive point in the Laver Cup.
He looked very much like Team Europe’s new leader in Boston on the court and in the post-match interviews. Though Federer made the trip to Boston, he did so only as a spectator and cheerleader, navigating the TD Garden on crutches after knee surgery in August.
At age 40, it is unclear when or if he will return to the tour, but what is clear is that this European team was still unstoppable without him or the other members of the Big Three: Nadal and Djokovic.
Carrying the Laver Cup forward without that superstar power will be a much bigger challenge.
“I’m definitely not worried about the event’s future,” Godsick said. “Tennis always produces new superstars. It always has, and it always will. There are new people holding up Grand Slam trophies. You see it coming now. If anything, I think we were lucky to be able to launch it in the era of such incredible tennis players.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/27/spor ... &smtyp=cur
by ashkor87 i dont see the point in a Europe versus RoW event.. there isn't a single player outside Europe who can compete with the Europeans! Maybe they should make it Western Europe versus Eastern Europe, or maybe make it like Hopman Cup, if women can play, the RoW would have a chance!
by
meganfernandez ashkor87 wrote:i dont see the point in a Europe versus RoW event.. there isn't a single player outside Europe who can compete with the Europeans! Maybe they should make it Western Europe versus Eastern Europe, or maybe make it like Hopman Cup, if women can play, the RoW would have a chance!
Yes I believe women could save the World
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
by ponchi101 As this is an exo, and therefore the sole purpose of this is money, combining men and women would be bad business in that there would be revenue lost. We talked about it before. A "NAVRATILOVA CUP" would be way more interesting in terms of how competitive it would be.
So dropping three men from the Laver Cup from each team and adding three women may be great fun, but not as profitable as having TWO events. Somewhere, a team of marketing experts are thinking this out.
(Maybe not. Maybe it is only us brilliant tennis TAT'ers that have these advanced thoughts).
by
ashkor87 meganfernandez wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 11:11 am
ashkor87 wrote:i dont see the point in a Europe versus RoW event.. there isn't a single player outside Europe who can compete with the Europeans! Maybe they should make it Western Europe versus Eastern Europe, or maybe make it like Hopman Cup, if women can play, the RoW would have a chance!
Yes I believe women could save the World
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
he he, yes, true enough...
by
ponchi101 Agree. Megan maybe hit the solution to not only The Laver Cup, but to a lot of other things
by
dmforever What about, instead of reducing the number of men and replacing them with women, an equal number of women were added, mixed doubles matches were added, and the whole thing was made into a week long event? And what about adding players who were retired, but who still wanted to play, and those matches counted? And maybe make the match ups random, a la a tournament draw? Or just some of them? Or randomizing how many points each match is worth? Or randomizing if it's a one-set match, a 2 out of 3, or just a 10-point tie break shoot out right before the match? Just throwing the pasta against the wall here to see what sticks...
Kevin
by
meganfernandez dmforever wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:16 pm
What about, instead of reducing the number of men and replacing them with women, an equal number of women were added, mixed doubles matches were added, and the whole thing was made into a week long event? And what about adding players who were retired, but who still wanted to play, and those matches counted? And maybe make the match ups random, a la a tournament draw? Or just some of them? Or randomizing how many points each match is worth? Or randomizing if it's a one-set match, a 2 out of 3, or just a 10-point tie break shoot out right before the match? Just throwing the pasta against the wall here to see what sticks...
Kevin
Yeah I agree there are other solutions. Everyone loved Hopman Cup. I worry that a week-long event is too much in an already-packed schedule. I kind of like the idea of a retired player on each team, but would the quality be there? Sampras vs Henman or something? Davenport vs Hingis? Not sure these layers want to play again in their current form, but maybe they would want the challenge of preparing. How about Borg and McEnroe reenact their 80 and 81 finals on alternating years, shot for shot?
by JazzNU I realize this isn't a regular tour event, but it is far more than a regular exhibition, so I'm not completely clear on the dislike for the overall idea here, which is what I feel like I've been getting around these parts for the last few months. It's a competitive tournament, players give actual effort in it. It's been the way they've competed in it since they started, no one is doing repeated trick shots to entertain the crowd the way they do in an actual exhibition.
This is a great showcase for tennis similar to Ryder Cup for golf, one that has secured impressive TV deals around the world so that it has quite a bit of reach. So, why don't you like what it can do for the sport?
And here's another question for you all. Why do you like and talking positively about the Hopman Cup and not call it an exhibition, but hate or at least dislike Laver Cup?
by Suliso Don't count me in on any Laver cup hate, but maybe because people think this event damaged further Davis Cup?
by ponchi101 I don't hate or dislike the Laver Cup. It simply is not competitive.
Granted, on day one, two points here and there would have made it ROTW 3, Europe 1. But it wasn't.
I simply do not believe that a cup that is always won by the same team will last too long. It was what happened to the Wightman Cup. When the USA Vs Great Britain became non competitive, the cup was over.
by
ponchi101 dmforever wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:16 pm
What about, instead of reducing the number of men and replacing them with women, an equal number of women were added, mixed doubles matches were added, and the whole thing was made into a week long event? And what about adding players who were retired, but who still wanted to play, and those matches counted? And maybe make the match ups random, a la a tournament draw? Or just some of them? Or randomizing how many points each match is worth? Or randomizing if it's a one-set match, a 2 out of 3, or just a 10-point tie break shoot out right before the match? Just throwing the pasta against the wall here to see what sticks...
Kevin
Only thing I would say is that anything longer than 4 days would be too much. The finances of all those players would also be too much. But, as you say, something that will stick.
But I really don't know.
by
JazzNU ponchi101 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 7:06 pm
I don't hate or dislike the Laver Cup. It simply is not competitive.
Granted, on day one, two points here and there would have made it ROTW 3, Europe 1. But it wasn't.
I simply do not believe that a cup that is always won by the same team will last too long. It was what happened to the Wightman Cup. When the USA Vs Great Britain became non competitive, the cup was over.
I'd definitely say your comments have made it seem like at the very least you dislike the Laver Cup, so I'm surprised to hear you say this.
Simply not competitive? Is there a reason you're using this year as a measuring stick for overall competitiveness? It came down to the final match at the 2019 and the final day in 2018. This is why I'm asking these questions. To me, there seems to be an unwillingness by many to give the Laver Cup a chance, just figure out a way to make it seem like it's doomed no matter what and get it off the schedule as quick as possible.
by ponchi101 When I hate something or somebody, my comments usually are like this:
The %&%#&%ing piece of $%$#"$% Laver %&%%$$% Cup is &%&%$#$ totally and ##$%%$$%& worthless, and I wish....
You get my point.
I am not truly sold on the Cup. I think it is indeed a test to take away from DC, and it is a glorified Exo. But I have watched them all, and that is my problem with it. I have never seen one in which I did not know, from the first match, that Europe would win. It is lacking something, for me.
I hate few things, and I try to hate few people. That category is reserved to the political class of my country, some sectors of the political class of yours, and particularly loathsome people around the world. About things? Basically broccoli and cauliflower. Other than that, it is a verb that I try not to use.
by JazzNU I don't think at all about Davis Cup when watching Laver Cup. Now the ATP Cup, that feels like it's stealing Davis Cup's thunder, especially in it's new format, but that is at least partly DC's fault for changing the location aspect of the competition and eliminating the home crowd's enthusiasm.
Are you similarly down on the ATP Cup?
Also, I have zero belief you knew how 2019's version would shake out. That Europe would win? Believable. That they would just barely eek out a win and have to overcome Jack Sock winning a singles match? That they'd be losing going into the final match and need a match tiebreak to win LC? That was a very competitive and unpredictable Laver Cup and I don't believe anyone foresaw how it unfolded.
by ti-amie Laver Cup? An exho on steroids. I don't care one way or the other which was why I guess I had such a hard time putting up a thread about it. Don't forget it's on the ATP calendar as an ATP event with no points. Why is it on the ATP calendar if it's nothing more than an exhibition event? I'd rather a Hopman Cup style competition than this.
by Deuce I don't like it because it - and the ATP Cup - are clearly designed to kill Davis Cup...
And because I believe that the matches are 'fixed'. In previous years, as has been mentioned, it went down to the wire. I think that was very likely pre-arranged - it seemed pretty obvious.
This year, the results were obviously one-sided - but that's what everyone expected, based on the rankings of the players. Had it been close to the finish again, many people would have been claiming it's fixed. So they made sure it didn't happen.
But they still managed to manufacture some drama this year - 80% of the sets played were very close.
It's an exhibition. And exhibitions are fixed in some way.
If they play it with wood racquets, I'd be (slightly) more interested.
If they expand it to be bigger and/or longer (without the wood racquets), I'll very likely find more interesting things to do with my time for the duration of the event.
by
ponchi101 JazzNU wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:09 pm
I don't think at all about Davis Cup when watching Laver Cup. Now the ATP Cup, that feels like it's stealing Davis Cup's thunder, especially in it's new format, but that is at least partly DC's fault for changing the location aspect of the competition and eliminating the home crowd's enthusiasm.
Are you similarly down on the ATP Cup?
Also, I have zero belief you knew how 2019's version would shake out. That Europe would win? Believable. That they would just barely eek out a win and have to overcome Jack Sock winning a singles match? That they'd be losing going into the final match and need a match tiebreak to win LC? That was a very competitive and unpredictable Laver Cup and I don't believe anyone foresaw how it unfolded.
ATP cup also does not mean much to me. I find it is a great warm up event for the players prior to the Aussie and therefore, it is great for them to play it.
I did not know how the 2019 Laver Cup would finish. I knew Europe would win. That's all I said.
by JazzNU Still don't understand the positive way Hopman Cup is talked about versus the much more negative way Laver Cup is. If someone wants to share why this is, I'd love to know. Genuinely don't understand.
Also, Hopman Cup is something that I don't think almost any non-tennis fan outside of Australia has ever heard of, which is a huge problem. I'd even argue that plenty of tennis fans aren't all that familiar with and have rarely watched it. So even if it's great in Australia, it's not doing anything to showcase the sport worldwide.
by
skatingfan JazzNU wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 3:46 pm
Still don't understand the positive way Hopman Cup is talked about versus the much more negative way Laver Cup is. If someone wants to share why this is, I'd love to know. Genuinely don't understand.
Also, Hopman Cup is something that I don't think almost any non-tennis fan outside of Australia has ever heard of, which is a huge problem. I'd even argue that plenty of tennis fans aren't all that familiar with and have rarely watched it. So even if it's great in Australia, it's not doing anything to showcase the sport worldwide.
Hopman Cup is the tennis event that just didn't take itself that seriously, and I think that it has a special place in the heart's of hardcore tennis fans.
The year Thanasi Kokkinakis played 'the sub' as an example of the quirks that made that event fun to follow.
by ponchi101 The Hopman cup was founded in 1989, so it has by now a reasonable run.
But, it is not also to trip over. It clearly states it is an exo, it is a lot of hit and giggles. It is not to be taken son seriously, either.
by
JazzNU ponchi101 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 4:52 pm
The Hopman cup was founded in 1989, so it has by now a reasonable run.
But, it is not also to trip over. It clearly states it is an exo, it is a lot of hit and giggles. It is not to be taken son seriously, either.
Yes, but many have been calling Hopman a competition and have been saying Laver is an exhibition but clearly mean that in a negative way. So just trying to figure out the difference. I thought Hopman looked to be more exo than Laver personally, but I have barely watched it and when I have been able to see it, it's the mixed doubles, which probably isn't the best barometer.
A reasonable run? Okay. But how well known is it outside of Australia? I've seen barely a mention of it outside of Tennis Channel, and even then, only in recent years. Having a great run but very little impact is worth noting and seems to fit here.
by ponchi101 I would not disagree with that. It is a little exo, named after a great coach. Again, it was useful for some players to get some playing time before the Aussie.
by Deuce Maybe it's because the Hopman Cup doesn't pretend to be anything but a fun exhibition, whereas the Laver Cup is an exhibition which tries to be regarded as a serious and legitimate event, with lots of marketing, lots of money spent, etc.
The Laver Cup takes itself very seriously - but realistically, it's a show - and that's it's only purpose.
by JazzNU Possibility for next year.
by ashkor87 I am boycotting Laver Cup;; first of all, it is just that Federer wants to play doubles with Nadal, that is all it is about.. Europe versus the RoW is pointless, would make sense if it included the WTA. Otherwise they should just play eastern Europe versus Western Europe or soem such!
by
Deuce ti-amie wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 2:03 am
Come on, people... with a small effort, a Maxply Fort and Borg Pro could have easily been found for this photo!
by Deuce The only thing worth watching the Laver Cup for is the beautiful contrast of colours...
The red and blue shirts on the background of the neutral grey court is very pleasing to the eye.
by ponchi101 I will not boycott because, why boycott a nice exo?
This will slowly fade away in a few years after Roger, Rafa and Nole are gone, and the Europeans remain undefeated for 15 years.
Then again, the USA kept the Americas Cup (yachting) for 143 and it was still run. One has to wonder how many people will pay for this.
I will try to watch the Roger/Rafa match.
by ponchi101 When Borg is standing with two men that almost CUADRUPLE his slam count... wow.
by ti-amie They all seem to have consulted tailors. There's not a bad fit to be seen (I don't think).
Except for JMac of course. And one guy on the far right...
I really had no idea who is playing until now but is there a chance Team World or whatever they're calling it this year will lose?
by ti-amie Friday, September 23, 2022 Day 1
EUR 0 - 0 WLD
O2 Arena Starts At 1:00 Pm
R16
Casper Ruud VS Jack Sock
Followed By
R16
Stefanos Tsitsipas VS Diego Schwartzman
Not Before 7:00 Pm
R16
Andy Murray VS Alex de Minaur
Followed By
R16
Roger Federer/Rafael Nadal VS Jack Sock/Frances Tiafoe
by ponchi101 It must be a clause in the contract:
Impeccable clothing and grooming is expected.
by
Deuce
For English in Canada, TSN is doing it:
TSN 5 is broadcasting the Laver Cup at 7:30am and 2pm, eastern time today.
Then on TSN 3 tomorrow, and TSN 2 on Sunday.
by
skatingfan Deuce wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:23 am
For English in Canada, TSN is doing it:
TSN 5 is broadcasting the Laver Cup at 7:30am and 2pm, eastern time today.
Then on TSN 3 tomorrow, and TSN 2 on Sunday.
Interesting. I checked both TSN's website, and the Laver Cup website. TSN didn't have anything listed for the Laver Cup, and the Laver Cup website says the only broadcast for Canada is TVA, but it's listed on my cable guide.
by
Deuce skatingfan wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:39 am
Deuce wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:23 am
For English in Canada, TSN is doing it:
TSN 5 is broadcasting the Laver Cup at 7:30am and 2pm, eastern time today.
Then on TSN 3 tomorrow, and TSN 2 on Sunday.
Interesting. I checked both TSN's website, and the Laver Cup website. TSN didn't have anything listed for the Laver Cup, and the Laver Cup website says the only broadcast for Canada is TVA, but it's listed on my cable guide.
It's on the TSN website schedule...
https://www.tsn.ca/live/schedule
by
skatingfan
But not on their tennis schedule.
https://www.tsn.ca/atp-on-tsn-national- ... e-1.430051
And now the Laver Cup website has been updated - TSN must have decided last minute to add it to their schedule after Federer announced his retirement, and the big 4 decided they were all going to play the event.
by martini4me Laver Cup teams have bloated to eight per side?
Why is Jack Sick on the team? Or at least, why Us he not restricted to doubles matches?
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by ashkor87 Pathetically slow court..Sock isn't too quick but he is powerful..doing well against Ruud...boring, though
by ponchi101 Ended up being an entertaining match.
I will go train at noon, in time to come back and watch Roger's farewell. I say Tiafoe and Sock have a better than average chance.
by
ashkor87 ponchi101 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:17 pm
Ended up being an entertaining match.
I will go train at noon, in time to come back and watch Roger's farewell. I say Tiafoe and Sock have a better than average chance.
Agree..Sock is a very good doubles player ..but of course so is Nadal
by ashkor87 Competes with IW for title of slowest court on the planet...Nadal is clearly the leader of Team Europe...though Fed and Djoko are present ..I find that very interesting
by MJ2004 WTF?
Protester sets fire to his arm during Laver Cup opening session - The Guardian
The opening session of this year’s Laver Cup in London was overshadowed when a protester set fire to his arm during the match between Stefanos Tsitsipas and Diego Schwartzman.
Tsitsipas clinched the first set by a 6-2 score and during the changeover at O2, a spectator ran on to the court and set his arm on fire.
The protestor was wearing a T-shirt which read “End UK Private Jets” and was quickly dragged out of the court after water had been poured on his burning arm. After a brief delay, the match, the second of day one, was able to resume.
by
JazzNU martini4me wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:54 pm
Laver Cup teams have bloated to eight per side?
Why is Jack Sick on the team? Or at least, why Us he not restricted to doubles matches?
It was 8 last year too. The main team plus alternates.
And today's first match is why Jack Sock is on the team and not just doubles. He's by far one of the best Laver Cup players for the World Team in their short history, no matter his ranking. He shows up every single time, which is truly what you're looking for in an exo.
by JazzNU For the Roger faithful, he's doing considerably more social media than he ever does, so check IG more regularly if you're interested. He just did a quick live on his way to today's practice and Nadal was with him. He never does this much stuff, but has been doing quite a bit this week.
by JazzNU Scroll for the Team World photo. There is obviously considerably less Team World coverage this year, there's regularly more Team Europe attention, but this year they aren't even pretending to make it anything approaching equal.
by JazzNU And still photos of the Big 4
by
meganfernandez ashkor87 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:12 pm
Competes with IW for title of slowest court on the planet...Nadal is clearly the leader of Team Europe...though Fed and Djoko are present ..I find that very interesting
Yeah, I don't know if it's because he's just more intense and a more natural coach, or because he's closer to the guys or because he has 22... maybe the others are lke, Why would I listen to the guy who only has 20 or 21 Slams when I could listen to the one with 22?
I love the bench conversations, especially player to player. Fascinating to know what resonates with them about a match.
by
meganfernandez MJ2004 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:39 pm
WTF?
Protester sets fire to his arm during Laver Cup opening session - The Guardian
The opening session of this year’s Laver Cup in London was overshadowed when a protester set fire to his arm during the match between Stefanos Tsitsipas and Diego Schwartzman.
Tsitsipas clinched the first set by a 6-2 score and during the changeover at O2, a spectator ran on to the court and set his arm on fire.
The protestor was wearing a T-shirt which read “End UK Private Jets” and was quickly dragged out of the court after water had been poured on his burning arm. After a brief delay, the match, the second of day one, was able to resume.
I mean... maybe it was a last resort? Had nothing else to set on fire? At least he used his own arm and not someone else's. This is really strange, though.
by meganfernandez The announcer called Casper Ruud the Norwegian Nail Gun. I'm all for nicknames, but they can't come from the marketing department.
Dr. Feelgood for De Minaur was a little better, after all his drop shots, but he's already Demon.
by
meganfernandez ti-amie wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:58 pm
Yeah, this right after he beat Murray in front of a London crowd. Everyone knows World is supposed to let Federer win, anyway.
by meganfernandez
She should be on the roster, along with other chicks.
by martini4me In his last competitive match, Roger finds something new to do: hit a ball THROUGH the laces attaching the netcord to the post.
And they also assigned Mohammed to umpire this match.
by
meganfernandez martini4me wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:25 pm
In his last competitive match, Roger finds something new to do: hit a ball THROUGH the laces attaching the netcord to the post.
And they also assigned Mohammed to umpire this match.
Crazy shot. Fitting that Roger is still coming up with no-way shots until the very end. On the bench, he said, "My eyes are still good. I saw it go through." Love that Mo is in the chair. I wonder if he's Roger's favorite umpire.
by martini4me Announcer just said that tennis might be Nadal's second-, or third-, best sport, noting he's very skilled at soccer and golf. Still, that's an absolutely preposterous statement.
by
meganfernandez martini4me wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:42 pm
Announcer just said that tennis might be Nadal's second-, or third-, best sport, noting he's very skilled at soccer and golf. Still, that's an absolutely preposterous statement.
Truly absurd. Which one has he spent tens of thousands of hours training? That's his best sport.
by ponchi101 Uncle Tony did say that the reason Rafa "only" has won 22 slams is his fault. You know, he told him to play left handed when he is a natural right handed.
Guess we will never know.
by meganfernandez Tiafoe was called for a double hit and lost the point - it was BP for Fedal to get back on serve in the 2nd. The racket made two contacts with the ball on the same bounce. It was a half volley, and the first contact was right at the ground and then the racket continued forward and touched the ball again in the air. One motion, two touches. So that's illegal?
Berrettini, Nadal and Federer discussed it on the bench, and even they aren't clear. Berrettini seems to think it was illegal because on the first touch, the ball was traveling in one direction (into Tiafoe's court) and on the second touch, it was traveling in the opposite direction - so like a carry. Federer says if it was one swing, it was probably legal.
I think it was one swing, but very tough to call in the moment. Don't know why umpire can't review it and revise the call. Everyone in the stadium saw the video. Why not use it?
by ponchi101 I think that's illegal. It was one motion, but the second impact was after a delay.
by ti-amie Tennis Twitter right now.
by
meganfernandez ti-amie wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:38 pm
Tennis Twitter right now.
And the whole O2. Everyone was crying. Rafa was crying.
by ti-amie Yep. It looks like it was very emotional for everyone involved.
by MJ2004 That was too intense. I was disappointed he didn't get a chance to go out in a slam, but after seeing this, that might have been just too much. It was a little more contained this way.
And Rafa in tears. Wow. Used to seeing Roger in tears, fully expected it, did not expect to see Rafa break down as well.
Overall an awesome experience, with the big four, his family, etc.
by JazzNU Federer fans morphing into acting like Djokovic fans on social media at the moment. Sigh.
by
ashkor87 meganfernandez wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:54 pm
ashkor87 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:12 pm
Competes with IW for title of slowest court on the planet...Nadal is clearly the leader of Team Europe...though Fed and Djoko are present ..I find that very interesting
Yeah, I don't know if it's because he's just more intense and a more natural coach, or because he's closer to the guys or because he has 22... maybe the others are lke, Why would I listen to the guy who only has 20 or 21 Slams when I could listen to the one with 22?
I love the bench conversations, especially player to player. Fascinating to know what resonates with them about a match.
Probably that he is the most intense...
by
3mlm martini4me wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:54 pm
Laver Cup teams have bloated to eight per side?
Why is Jack Sick on the team? Or at least, why Us he not restricted to doubles matches?
Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
Laver Cup has a rule that doubles players must also play at least one singles match. I read somewhere that there was a mutually agreed exception for Roger Federer this year.
I was surprised when the European Team had two alternates - Berrettini and Norrie - while the World Team had only one. Both of the original teams had only one alternate each. However, looking at Saturday's schedule I see that both Berrettini and Norrie are playing singles. I assume that means that both Federer
and Nadal have withdrawn from the rest of the tournament.
by Deuce The highlight of the Roger ceremony after the doubles match was Nadal crying. A lot. That was truly touching.
I think his emotions were partly because of seeing his friend - and the rivalry - go away... but also because seeing Roger leave reminds Rafa that he's pretty close to the finish line himself, as well - especially with the recent injuries...
It was interesting to see one of Roger's twin girls and one of his twin boys being significantly more emotional than their respective twin.
What I really DID NOT like about the ceremony was Jim Courrier's inane and asinine questions to Roger - they seemed very out of place in that moment. Courrier is so incredibly smug and full of himself...
And the singer singing that song live (or lip-synching). She went on for what seemed to be a 10 full minutes. That was not good, either. It looked like she thought the stage and spotlight was hers, and that the crowd was there to watch her perform. And, of course, it was a marketing opportunity for her, which was also very out of place. It also took attention away from Roger being with his family (which occurred during the song).
It would have been better had they just played the audio of a song (they could have easily found an appropriate OLD song to play instead of using a more current song which they were hoping to sell to people).
by ashkor87 After Brexit, why are Norrie and Murray playing for Europe?!
by
ponchi101 Well, the UK is still in Europe, right? They separated economically, not geographically.
This was a good farewell. Especially in that his fellow BIG players were able to be there. That would not have happened at Basel, for example.
by ashkor87 Djokovic reminding us he is still the best player in the world...
by
ashkor87 ponchi101 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 24, 2022 3:50 pm
Well, the UK is still in Europe, right? They separated economically, not geographically.
This was a good farewell. Especially in that his fellow BIG players were able to be there. That would not have happened at Basel, for example.
It would have brought a little more balance to the teams...
by ponchi101 Oh, if you meant having the UK as THE WORLD, to make it more balanced, maybe.
I wonder how the UK would feel about being labeled "Rest of the World". Not sure if they would take it kindly.
by ponchi101 Honor where honor is due. It has not been a walk in the park.
Edit. That was an understatement (I am getting to be good about those). A good win for The World. Now this becomes interesting.
by JazzNU There's been a lot of haters on here about the Laver Cup because supposedly Team World had no chance of winning. I do hope that's no longer the main discussion point when this tournament is mentioned.
Congrats to Team World. Almost did it a few years ago when they had no business being that competitive, but this year, much less of a surprise, but still an underdog win. Nicely done.
by meganfernandez So glad Tiafoe got a moment like that. And FAA stepped up big time. McEnroe is beside himself. Imagine if they'd had Kyrgios. Crossed my mind a couple times that he basically wasn't invited to this party. Did Tommy Paul play or was the the alternate? I like him a lot now. This was a good team and will be even stronger when they bring in the women.
by
ponchi101 JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 25, 2022 5:27 pm
There's been a lot of haters on here about the Laver Cup because supposedly Team World had no chance of winning. I do hope that's no longer the main discussion point when this tournament is mentioned.
Congrats to Team World. Almost did it a few years ago when they had no business being that competitive, but this year, much less of a surprise, but still an underdog win. Nicely done.
But in the poll, you yourself also chose A WALK IN THE PARK for team Europe. So, when we have an opinion about a possible result and it gets proven wrong, we become haters? I don't think that people here "hate" this event.
Until this year, this had been an event clearly dominated by Europe. This is a good turn, as it now becomes a more balanced event.
by
ti-amie 
by Deuce I still say that this event is scripted - like other exhibitions.
Every year, there are a large number of matches that go the distance. Again this year, we saw several 'match tiebreaks' for the 3rd set...
It looks to me that it's scripted to be dramatic and captivating (and therefore more profitable in $$).
Sorry, but I just can't buy into it.
by ti-amie I didn't watch any of it. The photo's and video I posted are the closest I got to watching.
by ponchi101 There were some good matches.
The Roger/Rafa match was emotional, although not very good quality. It was a good send off, although of course, it would have been better for them to win.
Novak went out flat today, and Felix played well.
I also watched Tiafoe/Stefanos, which ended up being high quality after the first set.
It's an exo, but they play seriously for it.
by
JazzNU ponchi101 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 25, 2022 5:48 pm
JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Sep 25, 2022 5:27 pm
There's been a lot of haters on here about the Laver Cup because supposedly Team World had no chance of winning. I do hope that's no longer the main discussion point when this tournament is mentioned.
Congrats to Team World. Almost did it a few years ago when they had no business being that competitive, but this year, much less of a surprise, but still an underdog win. Nicely done.
But in the poll, you yourself also chose A WALK IN THE PARK for team Europe. So, when we have an opinion about a possible result and it gets proven wrong, we become haters? I don't think that people here "hate" this event.
Until this year, this had been an event clearly dominated by Europe. This is a good turn, as it now becomes a more balanced event.
That was last year's poll, which was indeed a walk in the park for Team Europe. And I was hardly someone pushing the this tournament is ridiculous narrative. I've been defending that it has value for some time, last year included despite what I thought the result would be.
And Team World almost won before this year, came within one match of doing so. Feels like most here act like that never happened, which is just strange at this point. It clearly isn't just about the rankings or Jack Sock wouldn't be one the most valuable World team members in the short history of the event.
And I disagree, there's a lot of haters on here where this event is concerned. Seem to be hoping for it's demise. And saying haters doesn't mean they actually have to hate the event, more like, they are overly negative or critical about it, which is what I've seen.
by ashkor87 Somebody here said Jack Sock is the best doubles player in the world..I was surprised when I saw that comment but now I see that was right ...
by
ponchi101 JazzNU wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 12:44 am
...
That was last year's poll, which was indeed a walk in the park for Team Europe. And I was hardly someone pushing the this tournament is ridiculous narrative. I've been defending that it has value for some time, last year included despite what I thought the result would be.
And Team World almost won before this year, came within one match of doing so. Feels like most here act like that never happened, which is just strange at this point. It clearly isn't just about the rankings or Jack Sock wouldn't be one the most valuable World team members in the short history of the event.
And I disagree, there's a lot of haters on here where this event is concerned. Seem to be hoping for it's demise. And saying haters doesn't mean they actually have to hate the event, more like, they are overly negative or critical about it, which is what I've seen.
I thought I had reset the poll. My bad.
by skatingfan Not quite the star power of previous years.
by ti-amie Do you think this will be around this time next year?
by
skatingfan ti-amie wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 1:59 am
Do you think this will be around this time next year?
Not sure - I guess we'll see whether the interest continues - according to the website Federer will be there so that probably helps a bit with ticket sales.
by
ashkor87 meganfernandez wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:36 am
Not excited about Laver Cup at all without Roger and Rafa.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The whole idea of Laver Cup was to enable Federer to play doubles with Nadal...now they may as well shut it down!
by
meganfernandez ashkor87 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 4:32 am
meganfernandez wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:36 am
Not excited about Laver Cup at all without Roger and Rafa.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The whole idea of Laver Cup was to enable Federer to play doubles with Nadal...now they may as well shut it down!
I thought it was to make a boatload of money for Team8, Federer's company, plus his sponsors, and honor Laver.
It certainly won't be as popular. Amazing they can charge the same ticket price.
by ponchi101 I said it in TAT1.0. The moment Roger (and Rafa) would be not playing, this idea would be in trouble.
Team WORLD is offering close to the best there is. Team Europe is lacking a lot.
by skatingfan Where are Alcaraz, and Medvedev?
by
meganfernandez ponchi101 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2023 10:40 pm
I said it in TAT1.0. The moment Roger (and Rafa) would be not playing, this idea would be in trouble.
Team WORLD is offering close to the best there is. Team Europe is lacking a lot.
I think if Roger is on the bench or on screen somehow, he can carry it. The best moments aren't the matches. They're the interactions. So let's see how involved his is.
Time to bring in the women, too. Wouldn't it be great if Coco, Wozniacki, and Jabeur were there? Or let them play a surprise retired player sometimes, not announced until they're on the scene, like Barty or Serena. Do you think these players would be too rusty to be useful, even in doubles? Or they could be additional coaches or something. There are a lot of ways to bring in stars for entertainment value, even if they aren't playing.
by ponchi101 I think they hedged themselves, regarding the women, with the name choice. The LAVER cup does not seem very inclusive.
When they changed the federation cup name to the BJK name, several of us talked about BJK already having too many things named after her; I always felt that the Fed cup renamed the MARTINA Cup would have been a better choice. So, that name is still available. A week long tournament, with the women playing for the M cup, the men for the L?
I am, of course. terrible at marketing.
by
meganfernandez ponchi101 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2023 4:13 pm
I think they hedged themselves, regarding the women, with the name choice. The LAVER cup does not seem very inclusive.
When they changed the federation cup name to the BJK name, several of us talked about BJK already having too many things named after her; I always felt that the Fed cup renamed the MARTINA Cup would have been a better choice. So, that name is still available. A week long tournament, with the women playing for the M cup, the men for the L?
I am, of course. terrible at marketing.
You know what, though, why can't women honor Laver, too? It's just a messaging issue. They could easily get around it.
by ponchi101 Oh, sure. Want to honor Laver? Go for it.
I just believe there are some other great women that can and should be honored, and I have always been partial to Martina. I believe she has never been really appreciated.
by ashkor87 Let us just call it the Federer Cup and be gone with it.
by
ponchi101 ashkor87 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 23, 2023 2:43 am
Let us just call it the Federer Cup and be gone with it.
IN. DEED.
About his strokes. He was born to play THIS sport. I bet he would have been a good athlete in other sports, but his skills set was designed for this. Still an amazing FH and BH (he was seldom given credit for that side).
by
skatingfan ashkor87 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 23, 2023 2:43 am
Let us just call it the Federer Cup and be gone with it.
Well it is being played in Rogers Arena.
